Tuesday, November 14, 2006

Daf Yomi - Beitza 18 - A Utensil Before Immersion

Our Gemora discusses the issue of being tovel a keli on Yom Tov. One is not permitted to use a new utensil produced by a Goy before he immerses it in the mikvah. One is accustomed to think that this is prohibited only due to the fact that he is obligated to immerse it in the mikvah. It is not like cooking with a utensil that is unkosher. It should not be considered like something which is treif. It could be compared to the prohibition of eating before reciting kiddush. Food is not prohibited then like a fast, since there is a mitzva of kiddush, one cannot eat until he discharges that obligation.

Rav Shlomo Zalman Auerbach in his sefer on Beitza, Minchas Shlomo asks a question based on this. The Rama rules that if A Yisroel and a Goy buy a utensil in partnership, the utensil does not require tevila before it is used. This is because the immersing in the mikvah will not accomplish anything since it will still be owned by the Goy. The Beis Meir asks on the logig of the Rama. While true that nothing will be accomplished with tevila, what has removed the prohibition from the utensil allowing it to be used? Rav Shlomo Zalman asks on the Beis Meir and explains the opinion of the Rama. Even if we will maintain that immersing a utensil bought from a Goy is Biblical, the prohibition of using it prior to the tevila is only Rabbinical. Perhaps it can be said that when tevila will not accomplish anything, there is no mitzva of tevila and therefore automatically there will be no prohibition against using this utensil.

It seems evident from the Beis Meir that he holds that a utensil prior to tevila is an object of issur and cannot be utilyzed unless there is something to be matir it.

The Rishonim on our daf explain the reason that one cannot be tovel a keli on yom Tov is because it would appear as if one would be fixing. This would also indicate that the utensil prior to the tevila is a 'chefetz d'issura' - an object which is inherently prohibited and not just because there is an obligation of tevila. Rav Shlomo Zalman states that it can be regarded as if the keli is tomei before immersion in the mikvah.


Anonymous said...

Maybe since all the Rishonim mean is that l'chatchilah one may not use the vessel prior to the tevilah and afterwards it can be used that would appear as if one "fixed" the keli?

Anonymous said...

Therefore it doesn't have to be catergorized as a "chaftzah d'isurah"

Avromi said...

i hear what youre saying but he obviously learns that it cnt be considered tikkun unless it was considered 'assur' before.

Avromi said...

he also proves from Shages arye 56 that the issur of using it before tevila is midoraysa and that can only be if its a cheftza d'isura.